Listen Now

 

We Christians can learn a great deal from Asher Lev, a Jew, in My Name is Asher Lev, by Chaim Potok. He teaches us that we have power within our craft, be it art, writing, woodworking, or something else. To tell the truth through our vocation is a great responsibility that can lead to pain. Pushing past the comfort of safety can and will hurt others, and so we must be empathetic and wise in our truth-telling. Just as Asher’s Hasidic Jewish faith tradition and community moored him, when we remain steeped in our Christian tradition and maintain a strong tie to our faith and art community, we are tethered. We learn to wait upon the Lord for guidance while continually bringing ourselves, our craft, and our community before him.

In this episode, Amy Baik Lee, a member artist of the Anselm Society Arts Guild, a founding member of The Cultivating Project, and a contributing writer at The Rabbit Room, and host Kristy Lahoda discuss how spiritual practices that help us grow like Asher did in fidelity, empathy, and love enable us to do the work the Lord has given us to do. This requires us to wait patiently, submit ourselves and our work for his review, and to surrender it all to Him. In the smaller task of learning to continually surrender the work of our craft to him and wait, we learn to do so in the other aspects of our lives. We find that Jesus holds the tension of suffering and hope in perfect love, so that any suffering we experience does not have to be without hope.

Please note that we have begun using referral links as a way to help support this site. We would appreciate if you would consider using the links to books/media mentioned on the site as a way to help us out. This does not add any cost to you!

Guest

Amy Baik Lee
Writer

Amy Baik Lee works from a desk looking out on a cottage garden, usually surrounded by children's drawings, teacups, and stacks of patient books. She is a member artist of the Anselm Society Arts Guild, a founding member of The Cultivating Project, and a contributing writer at The Rabbit Room. Ever seeking to "press on to [her] true country and to help others to do the same" (C.S. Lewis), she writes essays and stories about living with a Homeward longing.

Amy's website
Amy's articles at The Rabbit Room
Amy's articles at The Cultivating Project
Read more about Amy Baik Lee
Amy Baik Lee

Host

Kristy Lahoda
Fiction Writer, Spiritual Formation Practitioner, and Fiction that Forms Us Creator and Host

Kristy is a Renovaré Institute for Christian Spiritual Formation graduate (2018-2021), has a Ph.D. in chemistry, and is a contract scientific technical editor. She lives in central Ohio with Rob, her husband of 18 years, and their three children, 14 year-old girl/boy twins and a 12 year-old boy.

Read more about Kristy Lahoda
Kristy Lahoda

Show Notes

At 2:24, Amy quotes the Rebbe:

"A life should be lived for the sake of heaven. One man is not better than another because he is a doctor while the other is a shoemaker. One man is not better than another because he is a lawyer while the other is a painter. A life is measured by how it is lived for the sake of heaven."

Chaim Potok, My Name is Asher Lev (New York: Anchor Books, 2003), Kindle Edition, 191.

 

At 2:43, Amy mentions a quote by C.S. Lewis in Learning and War-time:

"The work of a Beethoven, and the work of a charwoman, become spiritual on precisely the same condition, that of being offered to God, of being done humbly 'as to the Lord'. This does not, of course, mean that it is for anyone a mere toss-up whether he should sweep rooms or compose symphonies. A mole must dig to the glory of God, and a cock must crow. We are members of one body, but differentiated members, each with his own vocation. A man's upbringing, his talents, his circumstances, are usually a tolerable index of his vocation.

C.S. Lewis, "Learning in War-Time." Sermon, Church of Saint Mary the Virgin, Oxford, England, Autumn, 1939, accessed March 18, 2023, https://www.christendom.edu/wp-content/uploads/2021/02/Learning-In-Wartime-C.S.-Lewis-1939.pdf.

 

At 4:11, Amy mentions that Leif Peterson, Eugene Peterson's son, said that his dad only had one [sermon]:

Beginning at 23:22 in the 11-03-18 edited Eugene Peterson Memorial, Leif Peterson said, "When I was in high school, I used to joke with my dad that he only had one sermon. And although it was a joke between us, I believed then, as I do now, that it is largely accurate. My dad had one message." Then he reads a poem he wrote for a commissioning service in Colorado for the commissioning of Eugene's biblical translation work of the New Testament for The Message.

Eugene Peterson Memorial Service, Kalispell, MT, November 3, 2018, accessed March 18, 2023, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZFrW5VB9tU.

 

At 4:54, Amy quotes what I had quoted earlier from My Name is Asher Lev:

"It would have made it more and more difficult to draw upon that additional aching surge of effort that is always the difference between integrity and deceit in a created work."

 

At 5:42, Amy quotes Katelyn Beaty in Celebrities for Jesus: How Personas, Platforms, and Profits are Hurting the Church

Amy talks about how Beaty discusses in her book how there are times when something we create is meant to be holy and held within our private worlds in order to develop us.

 

At 19:36, I quote Asher's response in a conversation he had with his mom about making pretty drawings:

"Was it a pretty drawing, Asher?"

"No, Mama. But it was a good drawing."

...

"You should make the world pretty, Asher," my mother whispered, leaning toward me. I could smell her breath.

"I don't like the world, Mama. It's not pretty. I won't draw it pretty."

Chaim Potok, My Name is Asher Lev (New York: Anchor Books, 2003), Kindle Edition, 27-28.

 

More Episodes

Season 2

Sensible Shoes, Part 2 - The Spiritual Disciplines of Lament and Confession within the Ignatian Examen

Episode 830 minSharon Garlough Brown

Welcome to the Season 2 season finale of Fiction that Forms us!

How do we become more receptive and responsive to the work of the Spirit within our lives? In her first novel, Sensible Shoes, from the series of the same name, Sharon Garlough Brown takes her characters on a journey of practicing various spiritual disciplines. In this episode, I talk to author Sharon Garlough Brown about the spiritual disciplines of lament and confession within the Ignatian Examen. The spiritual practice is one of attentiveness that enables our receptivity by reviewing our day with God in two movements: consolation—where we noticed and responded to God today—and desolation—where we were unaware of, ignored, or rejected God during our day.

Sensible Shoes - A Conversation about Hannah and Charissa

Episode 735 minSharon Garlough Brown

How do we overcome vices that the world teaches us to idolize? In her first novel, Sensible Shoes, from the series of the same name, Sharon Garlough Brown takes the reader through the growth journey of four characters, whose lives become interwoven throughout the novel as they embark on a sacred journey with God and each other. In this episode, I talk with author Sharon Garlough Brown about her novel, where we discuss the spiritual formation of Hannah and Charissa, two of the four main characters. Just as they learn to surrender their identities to God, we, too, are invited to surrender the worldly identity we’ve taken upon ourselves in order to put on our God-given identity as beloved child of God.

Kristin Lavransdatter, Part 2 – The Spiritual Practice of Reading

Episode 615 minDr. Jessica Hooten Wilson

How can reading be a spiritual practice, and why is reading Kristin Lavransdatter a good choice for this practice? Learn more on this episode, where Dr. Jessica Hooten Wilson and I continue our discussion on Kristin Lavransdatter in the trilogy Kristin Lavransdatter and how reading about her spiritual journey affords us an opportunity to study and come to terms with our own.

Kristin Lavransdatter, Part 1 – A conversation with Dr. Jessica Hooten Wilson

Episode 533 minDr. Jessica Hooten Wilson

At the end of your life, how would you feel if God had nearly always allowed you to follow your will? In the womb-to-tomb trilogy Kristin Lavransdatter, Kristin has this experience, which for her is one of sorrow that ultimately leads her to surrender. In this episode, I talk with professor and author Dr. Jessica Hooten Wilson about Kristin’s spiritual journey over a lifetime.

Jane Eyre, Part 2 – The Spiritual Practice of Reflecting on Your Spiritual Autobiography

Episode 433 minGrace Pouch

How can taking inventory of our spiritual life help us regard the character flaws of others with sensitivity and forgiveness? Learn more on this episode, where we discuss how Jane Eyre’s suffering affords her an introspection that helps shape her thoughts and actions. There are practices we can do to aid our spiritual introspection that will help cultivate the fruits of compassion and forgiveness in our lives like it did in Jane's life.

Jane Eyre, Part 1 – A conversation about Jane Eyre

Episode 349 minGrace Pouch

If you grew up unloved and unwanted, how difficult would it be to show love, grace, and forgiveness to those who don’t reciprocate? Jane, in the book Jane Eyre by Charlotte Brontë, shows us how.

The Hiding Place, Part 2 – The Spiritual Practice of Saying “Yes” to God

Episode 229 minA. S. "Pete" Peterson

What can the unspeakable horrors of a concentration camp teach us about theodicy? Learn more on this episode where guest A. S. (“Pete”) Peterson, author, artistic director of Rabbit Room Theatre, and producer at Lamb & Flag Studios, and host Kristy Lahoda discuss The Hiding Place and Betsie and Corrie ten Booms’ responses to the unspeakable evil they experienced at the Ravensbrück concentration camp and how they, as part of the cloud of witnesses, testify with gratitude to the goodness and sovereignty of God. They are exemplars for how we, too, can grow in obedience to God’s calling in our lives.

The Hiding Place, Part 1 – A conversation with A. S. "Pete" Peterson

Episode 127 minA. S. "Pete" Peterson

What if you were called to retell someone’s harrowing, God-soaked story? On this episode, learn how A. S. (“Pete”) Peterson, author and playwright, artistic director of Rabbit Room Theatre, and producer at Lamb & Flag Studios, was called to do just that. Pete and host Kristy Lahoda discuss the breadcrumb trail that led to his play adaptation turned cinematic stage production of Corrie ten Boom’s The Hiding Place.

Season 1

Fargo, Part 2: The Spiritual Practices of Simplicity and Resisting Hurry

Episode 1219 minDr. Chris Hall

Despite overwhelming need, why was the most important work in all of human history done without hurry? Learn more on this episode, where Dr. Chris Hall, Renovaré's President Emeritus and former Director of Academic Spiritual Formation and Distinguished Professor of Theology at Eastern University, and host Kristy Lahoda discuss Marge Gunderson, in the film Fargo, directed and produced by the Coen brothers. Marge, far from being naïve, is deliberate in her simplistic lifestyle, which allows her to discern and apprehend those whose world is darkness.

Fargo, Part 1: A conversation about Marge Gunderson

Episode 1141 minDr. Chris Hall

What can film noir teach us about the Biblical theme of light? Learn more on this episode, where Dr. Chris Hall, Renovaré's President Emeritus and former Director of Academic Spiritual Formation and Distinguished Professor of Theology at Eastern University, and host Kristy Lahoda discuss police chief Marge Gunderson in the film Fargo, directed and produced by the Coen brothers. Marge’s home life is one of stability that carries over into how she conducts her investigations, allowing her to be a light in the darkness.

My Name Is Asher Lev, Part 2 – The Spiritual Practices of Waiting on the Lord, Empathy, Fidelity, and Love

Episode 1027 minAmy Baik Lee

How can we remain faithful to the message God gives us as we practice our craft? Learn more on this episode with Amy Baik Lee, member artist of The Anselm Society and a founding member of The Cultivating Project, and host Kristy Lahoda as they discuss artist Asher Lev, in the novel My Name is Asher Lev by Chaim Potok. Asher learns that through his hands he has the power for both good and evil. Through the suffering he experiences, he grows in fidelity, empathy, and love by remaining steeped in his art and Hasidic faith tradition and maintaining a connection to his community. We, too, can grow in these virtues as we remain steeped in our Christian faith tradition and connected to our community, enabling us to do the work the Lord has given us to do. We can express suffering with a resonant note of hope because Jesus holds it all in his perfect love.

My Name Is Asher Lev, Part 1 – A Conversation about Asher Lev

Episode 91 hr 12 min Amy Baik Lee

What if our gifting and faith tradition are at odds? Learn more on this episode, where Amy Baik Lee, member artist of The Anselm Society and a founding member of The Cultivating Project, and host Kristy Lahoda discuss how Asher Lev, in the novel My Name is Asher Lev by Chaim Potok, stayed true to both his art and his faith and sought a third way, a way fraught with anguish but filled with truth born from love.

Maisie Dobbs, Part 2 – The Spiritual Practices of Silence, Solitude, and Study

Episode 854 minDr. Mimi Dixon

What can sitting in silence, solitude, and stillness teach us, and what does our body have to do with spiritual formation? Learn more on this episode, where Dr. Mimi Dixon, Renovaré Institute teacher and retired Presbyterian Pastor, and host Kristy Lahoda discuss how to remain calm and pay attention like Maisie Dobbs, in the book Maisie Dobbs by Jacqueline Winspear, in the midst of life’s storms so that we can follow Jesus as he runs toward people in pain in order to be present to them with him.

Maisie Dobbs, Part 1 – A Conversation about Maisie Dobbs

Episode 732minDr. Mimi Dixon

What can we learn from the layers of hardships—our own and those of others—we encounter? Find out on this episode, where Dr. Mimi Dixon, Renovaré Institute teacher and retired Presbyterian Pastor, and host Kristy Lahoda discuss how Maisie Dobbs, in the book Maisie Dobbs by Jacqueline Winspear, learns to pay attention to everything and everyone around her while she works on a case, which enables her to not only better understand situations but also sense people’s needs and move toward them as she awaits the revelation of truth.

Ready Player One, Part 2 – The Spiritual Practice of Study

Episode 623minMeshach Kanyion

What do virtual reality, obsessive devotion, and a billionaire have to do with spiritual formation? Join Meshach Kanyion, Senior Pastor at Church of the Savior United Methodist Church in Cincinnati, Ohio, and host Kristy Lahoda as they continue their discussion on the book Ready Player One by Ernest Cline and how we can become more Christlike through the spiritual discipline of study.

Ready Player One, Part 1 – A Conversation about Wade Watts

Episode 536minMeshach Kanyion

Is there anything we can learn from a video game? What about a book about a video game? Find out on this episode, where Meshach Kanyion, Senior Pastor at Church of the Savior United Methodist Church, and host Kristy Lahoda discuss how Wade Watts in the book Ready Player One by Ernest Cline learned that getting to know someone beyond the surface is helpful for understanding the world through their eyes.

Mare of Easttown, Part 2 – The Spiritual Practice of Welcoming Prayer

Episode 436minHelena Sorensen

How can welcoming the parts of us that aren’t like Jesus help us become more Christlike? Isn’t this a paradox? Find out on this episode, where author Helena Sorensen and host Kristy Lahoda discuss how to welcome what's part of us in the current moment and allow it to teach us. Join them as they discuss how Pennsylvania detective Mare Sheehan, in the HBO series Mare of Easttown written by Brad Ingelsby, learned to do this rather than bury it as she'd previously done, which allowed it to set up permanent residence.

Mare of Easttown, Part 1 – A Conversation about Mare Sheehan

Episode 342minHelena Sorensen

What can we learn from a woman who reaches the limit of herself after compartmentalizing everything, believing she can and should take care of everyone since everyone expects her to be the hero? Find out on this episode, where author Helena Sorensen and host Kristy Lahoda discuss how the community depends on Pennsylvania detective Mare Sheehan, in the HBO series Mare of Easttown written by Brad Ingelsby, to solve a series of murders in the community and through it is forced to face her own buried grief.

Les Misérables, Part 2 - The Spiritual Practices of Simplicity and Generosity

Episode 222minTed Harro

What do simplicity, availability, and darkness have to do with spiritual formation? Find out on this episode, where Renovaré President Ted Harro and host Kristy Lahoda discuss how Bishop Bienvenu, from Victor Hugo’s Les Misérables, has understood what the good life really means and has lived it out.

Les Misérables, Part 1 - A Conversation about Bishop Bienvenu

Episode 128minTed Harro

What do silver candle sticks, flowers, and a bishop named Welcome have to do with spiritual formation? Find out on this episode, where Renovaré President, Ted Harro, joins host Kristy Lahoda as they discuss how Monseigneur Bienvenu, from Victor Hugo’s Les Misérables, becomes a virtuous man over time who spreads gentle goodness wherever he goes.

All Flame by Carolyn Arends

Thank you to Carolyn Arends for permission to use her song, "All Flame", from the album Recognition, for the podcast's intro and outro. Carolyn is a singer/songwriter, the Director of Education at Renovaré, and was one of my instructors in the Renovaré Institute. She has become a dear friend.

You can learn more about Carolyn at carolynarends.com.

If you'd like to purchase the song or the album, you can download it at her web store.

Recognition album cover

Buy Us A Book

Planning, recording, and editing these podcast episodes takes a lot of time and energy. It's also expensive. Between hosting this website, hosting the podcast episodes, and various other expenses, there is a good-sized financial commitment for us. 

We love making this podcast and sharing it with everyone and we would love it if you would be willing to support us, even in a small way. If you want to contribute financially to the operational costs, you can use this Ko-fi widget to donate one-time or on an ongoing basis. Any amount helps and would support the ongoing expenses we face for running this podcast.